ER2 Final Thoughts: Response to Arrest Threats, Hinting at Racism, and TD Jakes is still a Modalist.

In a blog posted [here] 2 days ago, James McDonald defended the actions of the elder and security who kicked out Chris Rosebrough and Erin Benziger.

Great Vindication: Of course we defend our right to exclude from attendance those whose track record is unauthorized taping (a criminal act in Illinois) and out-of-context distortion. I stand by our security team’s professionalism and handling of any issue under pressure. I also feel a sense of vindication in that the conversations were edifying and helpful to all who heard them. The conference found a better price point, and I am hopeful that it will reach break-even $ through DVD sales.”

Apparently, this elder knew that Chris Rosebrough was going to tape the event, despite the fact that he wasn’t going to. He walked in and was recognized and thrown out. Forget just asking him to leave any recording devices in the car. I guess he was too big a threat with his “out of context” distortions of sermons, lectures, and any other craziness in the visible church. Chris Rosebrough is the host of Pirate Christian Radio. He regularly plays sermons in their entirety and comments on them much like I have here with churches like Potential and Elevation. He doesn’t just isolate a quote here or there. Anyhow, it seems like the guys there at the Elephant Room have some sort of gift of looking into a person’s mind and see their intentions.

This 2nd run at the Elephant Room was disastrous. The more I consider it, the more I believe Jakes is still a modalist. He basically said, “God in three persons, but I don’t like the term persons. We should use the Pauline term, ‘modes.'” And they were eating it up. TD Jakes seemed to receive a lot of praise from the guys there. Driscoll even called him a , “nuclear power plant.” Check out this portion of the ER2 that is fuller than the one I posted a few days ago:

Driscoll: We also would agree that in the nature of God there is mystery, and it’s like a dimmer switch: how much certainty, how much mystery. But within that, Bishop Jakes, for you the issue between Trinitarianism and Modalism at its essence is is one God manifesting Himself successively in three ways? Or one God three persons simultaneously existing eternally – so, your best is your understanding now? And I understand, there is some mystery – for sure. Would you say its One God manifesting Himself in three ways, or One God in three persons?

Jakes: I believe that neither one of them totally did it for me, but I think the latter one is where I stand today.

Driscoll: One God Three Persons?

Jakes: One God – Three Persons. One God – Three Persons, and here is why…I am there… I am not crazy about the word persons this is…most people who follow me know that that is really. My doctrinal statement is no different from yours except the word…

Driscoll: “manifestations”

Jakes: Manifest instead of persons. Which you describe as modalist, and I describe as Pauline. When I read…let me show you what I’m saying…when I read I Timothy 3:16 – I didn’t create this modalist, and without controversy which I think we have…we have bickered about something which Paul describes as a mystery, and I don’t think we should do that. “And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness. So God was manifest in the flesh.” Now Paul is not a modalist, but he does not think it is robbery to the divinity of God to think God was manifest in the flesh. And I think maybe it’s semantics, because [garbled], but Paul says this before this fight was started. But He also goes on “manifested in the flesh, justified in the spirit, seen by angels, preached up to the gentiles, believed on in the world, and received up into glory.” Now, when we start talking about that sort of thing, I think that it is important that we realize that there are distinctives between the Father and the working of the Son. The Father didn’t bleed, the Father didn’t die, only in the person of Jesus Christ… coming back for us in the person of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ has been with us, but only indwells us through the person of the Holy Spirit; we are baptized into the body of Christ by the power of the Holy Spirit. I don’t think any of that is objectionable to any of the three of us-

And thanks to the ER2, more confusion has been added into the visible church. Driscoll and McDonald, who have both condemned the damnable heresy of the Word Faith/Health Wealth/Prosperity message in the past, are now embracing one of the most influential Word Faith pastors as a brother. And all of this is a result of Jakes’ having danced around the question. No shocker here. I figured as much. I get surprised, but then again, not really. James McDonald even stepped down from the Gospel Coalition because the coalition had warned him to drop Jakes off of the roster.

Now Bryan Crawford Loritts, lead pastor of Fellowship Memphis, is calling the reformed crowd to repent of their one sided criticisms of TD Jakes [article found here]. At one point he goes off into some kind of racist tyrade about how the loudest critics are white reformed guys, and how reformed guys are usually white:

“The loudest voices in the conservative evangelical world are middle aged white Reformed guys. While their events are populated with a lot of young R/reformed people, on their stages and pulpits (at these same events) it is filled with middle aged white men. Because of this, the implicit message that is being sent is that the varsity section of the kingdom of heaven in 2012 is white, middle aged and Reformed.

Please don’t misunderstand me, I am not accusing anyone of racism. But we must be extremely careful of both the explicit and implicit messages that we send. Obviously, this implicit message is disheartening. What’s even more troublesome is to see what appears to be a few of my black brothers playing into what some have historically called white idolization in their longing to fit in with this Reformed crowd, that like crabs in a barrel they have unjustifiably attacked a dear brother, and brutha, in the Lord.”

Okay? Interesting. Why would you say this? This is stupid to even mention. I guess he is saying that this in some way could just be the ‘white guys’ hating on ‘black guys.’ Is that so? Voddie Baucham is a ‘black guy.’ Here is what he had to say on his Voddie Baucham Ministries Facebook page [here] about TD Jakes:

“‎Kevin King Jakes is a modalist. He does not hold to the historic doctrine of the Trinity. He ‘dodged’ the question and was allowed to use modalist language in doing so. He was NEVER going to be confronted. He was an honored guest. He was not going to be penned down. To do so would have required 1) a deft theological mind doing the questioning, 2) a clear statement for him to accept or deny (i.e., one of the creeds), and 3) a setting where it was not already assumed that he was one of many Christian “brothers” discussing their differences (thus, having a “conversation” with him is not the problem, but the context is).

The Scripture is clear on this point, “Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house or give him any greeting, for whoever greets him takes part in his wicked works.” (2 John 1:9–11)

Beyond that, he could have answered those questions perfectly and there still would have been a problem. Jakes does not hold to the biblical gospel. He is a false teacher.” 

I think that pretty much sums it up. Loritt’s argument is just another ad hominem (personal argument). The typical thing to hear is the argument against bloggers. Instead of actually dealing with arguments made by bloggers, many of the purpose driven pastors as well as others will respond with a personal attack. They will say something like, “Those bloggers are 43 years old, still live with their moms, watch Star Trek, and have no life.” Forget the fact that the speakers at the Elephant Room 2 have blogs. No, guys like me live with their moms and have no gf, even though I’m in my mid twenties, pay a mortgage, own a business, have been married for almost 5 years, and have two children. Well, I guess he’s right about me not having a gf. Anyhow, those who throw out ad hominems attempt to destroy the credibility of the one making the argument so as to never need to answer the criticism. Notice the following that was retweeted by TD Jakes concerning a blog written about him:

And this is nothing new, especially from the Elephant Room guys. I wonder what Elephant Room 3 will bring to the table? Maybe Jakes will be a regular now? Maybe now they’ll bring Todd Bentley or Joyce Meyer or Creflo Dollar. Who knows? The Elephant Room 2 put on the guise of a place of unity despite huge differences, but just turned out to be a forum of like minded pastors who apparently want to make Jakes seem orthodox. It reminds me of Piper’s attempts to make Rick Warren appear reformed. I wonder if there is anything in it for them? You decide. Time will tell.


3 thoughts on “ER2 Final Thoughts: Response to Arrest Threats, Hinting at Racism, and TD Jakes is still a Modalist.”

  1. Obviously the writer of this blog is confused as to what the phrase “crabs in a bucket” mean. Your comment: I guess he is saying that this in some way could just be the ‘white guys’ hating on ‘black guys is evidence of that very fact. Crabs in a bucket means a black person holding back another black person in order to get to a certain level whether it be a promotion, social status, or relationship.


    1. Hi, Jeannette, I’m confused by what you mean. Are you saying that the man who made the racial statement is trying to get to a certain level? Are you saying I am an African American? I’m not sure.


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